[i]Without 9/11 there would be no Patriot Act.

Without 9/11 there would be no NSA warrantless wiretapping program.

Without 9/11 there would be no Camp Delta and no Camp X-ray at Guantanamo Bay.

Without 9/11 there would be no Military Commissions Act and no coordinated program of extraordinary rendition, indefinite detention and torture of those defined as "enemy combatants".

Without 9/11 there would be no vast increase in secrecy and complete militarization of intelligence under the newly created office of the Director of National Intelligence.

Without 9/11 there would not be thousands of dead and dying emergency workers who are suffering crippling and fatal respiratory illnesses.

With...

Without 9/11 there would be no Patriot Act.

Without 9/11 there would be no NSA warrantless wiretapping program.

Without 9/11 there would be no Camp Delta and no Camp X-ray at Guantanamo Bay.

Without 9/11 there would be no Military Commissions Act and no coordinated program of extraordinary rendition, indefinite detention and torture of those defined as "enemy combatants".

Without 9/11 there would be no vast increase in secrecy and complete militarization of intelligence under the newly created office of the Director of National Intelligence.

Without 9/11 there would not be thousands of dead and dying emergency workers who are suffering crippling and fatal respiratory illnesses.

Without 9/11 there would be no vast increase in military and security spending that goes arm in arm with huge cutbacks in other key social programs (such as levees in New Orleans).

Without 9/11 there would have been no total abandonment of fiscal restraint, which has contributed to plunging the nation into an abyss of debt and looks likely to tip the world into a deep recession if not a complete depression.

And on and on and on.

Perhaps most importantly, without 9/11 there would be no "post 9/11 society/mentality".

The ongoing ignorance of official 9/11 lies will continue to feed the fear and hostility that this post 9/11 environment is founded upon. If it is "fanatical" to attempt to pay attention to the man behind the curtain, so to speak, then every member of the 9/11 truth movement should plead guilty.

Such people can groan all they like when questions over 9/11 are raised, it doesn't change the fact that every single significant action the Bush administration has taken over the last seven years, every attack on freedom and crime against humanity that they have committed stems from the events of 9/11.

Boy! Lots of mixed messages.

I did like the point, though, that we don't need to know specifics about 9/11 to put Bush on trial for war crimes.

Approval of torture is a war crime and there is documentation of that.

I'd recommend focusing first on facts that have documentaton that can be used now for war crimes, regular crimes (like the misuse of the Justice Dept. to prosecute political enemies) and civil crimes and violations of our U.S. Constitution.

Once trails like this get going there is also good chance that other things will spill out, perhaps about 9/11.

But let's get Bush in jail as soon as possible.

There is, too, a problem with 'conspiracy theories." Then tend not to go anywh...

Boy! Lots of mixed messages.

I did like the point, though, that we don't need to know specifics about 9/11 to put Bush on trial for war crimes.

Approval of torture is a war crime and there is documentation of that.

I'd recommend focusing first on facts that have documentaton that can be used now for war crimes, regular crimes (like the misuse of the Justice Dept. to prosecute political enemies) and civil crimes and violations of our U.S. Constitution.

Once trails like this get going there is also good chance that other things will spill out, perhaps about 9/11.

But let's get Bush in jail as soon as possible.

There is, too, a problem with 'conspiracy theories." Then tend not to go anywhere. They tend to get muddled. They tend to get associated with wild and crazy ideas, like: Aliens from outer space were responsible for 9/11.

A >Aliens from outter space causing 9/11?

Or is this the conspiracy that all the people on those planes were actually taken off the planes and the planes were crased into the WTC by remote control, directed by our military.

B > The US military using remote control planes causing 9/11?

Or is it the conspiracy theory of how there were NO planes involved, esp. at the Pentagon. All the damage was done by pre-planted explosives.

C> pre-planted explosives.?
Conspiracy Theory A, B, or C?

Or how about Conspiracy Theory D -- that Bushplanned and paid for the attack?

Conspiracy Theory E -- Bush had direct knowledge of the attack and deliberately did nothing?

Conspiracy Theory F - Other nations knew about the attack and Bush did not listen to them.

Conspiracy Theory G - Other nations knew about the attack and did not tell the USA because they wanted the attack to happen?

Seriously, what conspiracy theory is this clip talking about?

Yet, there is documentation of torture, indefinite detention, rendition, fabricated false intel to mislead a nation into war, use of the Justice Dept. for political reasons, etc.