 AcesLucky says: "She said her family believed in the Bible and that healing came from God. But she insisted that they were not "crazy religious people" "Even after her death, her parents, Dale and Leilani Neumann, who did not belong to any organised faith, prayed over her body in the hope that she might be resurrected." From another source: http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/17017766.html Quote: "We are remaining strong for our children," she said. "Only our faith in God is giving us strength at this time." The couple has three other children. Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin has said an autopsy determined Madeline died from diabetic ketoacidosis, an ailment that left her with too little insulin in her body. She had probably been ill for about 30 days, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weakness, he said. But Leilani Neumann said her daughter, a straight A student, was in good health until recently. She died owing to her parents stupidity.. "True faith is nothing like this. We should never exercise faith in spite of reason ... but always because of reason and evidence. Valid faith does not leap into the dark; it steps in the direction that reason points. Reason directs, faith acts. Blind faith undirected by reason is neither credible nor admirable. It it a foolish leap in the dark" - Josh McDowell. PS/ Now, go easy on me Aces for my comment, please - you know I have the intellectual depth of a saucer. Besides, I'm scared of you.  Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has. First Baptist Church Reason should be destroyed in all Christians. - Martin Luther These poor people gave up their reason in exchange for faith. An innocent child paid with her life for it. They've got three other kids. Are they fit parents? @wiccantexan Thanks for the link to Listing of similar cases: http://www.masskids.org/jcl/jcl_6appendix.html It's hard to read some of them. Some were so easy to solve it's like the parents were trying to prove something to the congregation at the expense of the children. It's like they had a deep seated need to belong to the group that their children were sacrificed as evidence. It's just so sad. this is exactly what faith is about 2. belief that is not based on proof: 3. belief in God or in the doctrines or teachings of religion: The Age of Reason Thomas Paine McDowell's thesis is that faith and reason are not mutually exclusive, but rather they are the 'flip side of the same coin'. "Faith and reason are the children of the same father. Reason provides a vital platform for faith to stand on as it peers over the edge of the empirical world in search of the ultimate absolute. ..... we assert that while the concept of a self-existent God is beyond the comprehension of reason, reason itself finds God to be a rational necessity. The concept of God is not in opposition to reason. It is simply above reason. It is not irrational, it is superrational. While the human mind cannot comprehend God, reason applied to available data tells us that something like God must exist" - Josh McDowell A flood was coming and the police went around and told everyone to evacuate. The went to the man's house and he said that God would save him, so they went to warn more people. Soon the water was up to the roof and men came with a row boat and the man declined saying God would save him. They rowed away to save other people. Finally, with water lapping his feet at the top of the roof, a helicopter came to remove the man from imminent death but he declined and shouted from the rooftop that God will save him. In heaven, St Peters asked the man why he died, the man shook his head and said he was sure God would save him. St Peters replied. He sent a policeman, a rowboat and a helicopter. But you r... The Divine already answered their prayers, by providing the science to develop the medicines for diabetes control. But they were too blind to see what was right in front of them. But of coarse! Too bad it will happen again Will the parents ever wonder why faith didn't work? Perhaps if they do, they can replant the seed of reason and gain back their minds. Being aware of the Christian Science faith I would say they will chalk it up to God's Will. They will probably blame themselves. But not for not providing the necessary medical care, but for not having enough faith. In the version of the story I clipped the mother was still hoping that with more fervent prayer a resurrection would be on the cards. I don't doubt that. They will probably blame themselves.Sometimes it's hard to blame people who think they are doing the right thing but don't know any better. I'm hoping, however, that the church gets prosecuted because they advised (authoritatively) in a medical matter in a way that was NOT in the best interest of the child. This case should be, by all rights, treated as non pre-meditated murder, at least. If noone gets prosecuted for this, it will happen again to some other innocent, child or adult.  it will happen again to some other innocent, child or adult.It has happened many times before and will happen many time again I'm sorry to say. The beliefs of Christian Science are standard. I held to those beliefs at one time in my life but the logical outcome is too severe for me. I believe the body has the ability to heal itself to an extent but after that science and medical technology should be able to assist. "I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reasons, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use." -Galileo Galilei "The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God and commits suicide." -Ralph Waldo Emerson "If God is dead, everything is permitted." -Unknown '"Come now, and let us reason together," Says the LORD." -Isaiah 1:18 John 14:12-14 (In Jesus' own words) 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it. ----- Mathew 18:19-20 (In Jesus' own words) 19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven. 20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them. ----- James 5:15 (In Je... God gave us minds and resources so that we could use them. If God is sovereign in all things, He can and will work through anything. I think it was foolish of the parents to refuse the things God gave us. I have been healed of an illness before, supernaturally. That doesn't mean that I should just sit there and wait for a supernatural healing when I can get medical help. Jesus didn't even heal EVERYONE he met. In regards to answered prayers on any subject though, answers come in several forms. It can be "yes" "No" "WAIT" and "try this instead". In regards to answered prayers on any subject though, answers come inYes, no, wait... Take a look at this short video on youTube that applies exactly to those answers. The best optical illusion in the world. http://youtube.com/watch?v=jk6ILZAaAMI An educated, reasonably intelligent person can follow this easily. It addresses it at exactly 2 minutes into the video. There are times when the authorities will step in and remove a child for their own safety. Shouldn't this have been one of those times? Where were they? People who believe in faith healing tend to also believe that abortion is murder. Hypocrites Popped for zizzy's comment. |
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