When I was in high school (back in the '60's) my father was on a jury for a rape case. He came home and told my mother and I a few things about what was going on in the trial, without discussing too much of the details. He did, however, tell me that the girl was someone I went to school with ... someone about my age ... but could say no more (and never did).

He did tell us that the rapist admitted that he only went looking to rob the couple (who were parking ... making-out) but that he was swayed into rape by the way the attractive young girl was dressed. I guess , in some eyes, that would look like she was at fault ... but it was the rapist, who could not control his lust and carnal urges...

When I was in high school (back in the '60's) my father was on a jury for a rape case. He came home and told my mother and I a few things about what was going on in the trial, without discussing too much of the details. He did, however, tell me that the girl was someone I went to school with ... someone about my age ... but could say no more (and never did).

He did tell us that the rapist admitted that he only went looking to rob the couple (who were parking ... making-out) but that he was swayed into rape by the way the attractive young girl was dressed. I guess , in some eyes, that would look like she was at fault ... but it was the rapist, who could not control his lust and carnal urges who was actually at fault!! The jury found him guilty.

"The first and best victory is to conquer self."— Plato

He did tell us that the rapist admitted that he only went looking to rob the couple (who were parking ... making-out) but that he was swayed into rape by the way the attractive young girl was dressed. I guess, in some eyes, that would look like she was at fault ... but it was the rapist, who could not control his lust and carnal urges who was actually at fault!! The jury found him guilty.

Good. I'd want your father on the jury back then. We forget that judgement is of its time. Things that horrify us now were normal way back. How far we have come along the road of equality.

I'll nit pick a bit for back then in the jury room. How that girl dressed to make out with her fella w...

He did tell us that the rapist admitted that he only went looking to rob the couple (who were parking ... making-out) but that he was swayed into rape by the way the attractive young girl was dressed. I guess, in some eyes, that would look like she was at fault ... but it was the rapist, who could not control his lust and carnal urges who was actually at fault!! The jury found him guilty.

Good. I'd want your father on the jury back then. We forget that judgement is of its time. Things that horrify us now were normal way back. How far we have come along the road of equality.

I'll nit pick a bit for back then in the jury room. How that girl dressed to make out with her fella would be appropriate and her/their business, She should be judged on the sequel of a voyeur's misdirected sex drive. If she shared her body voluntarily with her fella, must she share with a creep!

I've personally come across police getting their rocks off observing courting couples. I challenged one, threatening to report him. He backed down.

Resolution of guilt takes a long time TN. There are several factors involved in this. Those who knew the assailant or who chose not to fight back sometimes have the most guilt. Sometimes the guilt goes so deep because you feel you had negative feelings that you didn't pay attention to in one form or another. You may feel stupid for putting trust in that particular person. Sometimes even therapists don't let the person speak of their guilt, which I feel is very important to verbalize from time to time, or you can even feel guilty for having guilt. It does help to enpower yourself by changing the words to regret and hindsight which is a very important way of looking at things, but for so...

Resolution of guilt takes a long time TN. There are several factors involved in this. Those who knew the assailant or who chose not to fight back sometimes have the most guilt. Sometimes the guilt goes so deep because you feel you had negative feelings that you didn't pay attention to in one form or another. You may feel stupid for putting trust in that particular person. Sometimes even therapists don't let the person speak of their guilt, which I feel is very important to verbalize from time to time, or you can even feel guilty for having guilt. It does help to enpower yourself by changing the words to regret and hindsight which is a very important way of looking at things, but for some people talking in precise terms of what they actually did "wrong" is very important too
I felt this clip brought up some very good points. It seems as though people have attitudes that are directed toward making the person who has suffered the trauma of having someone make you do things against your will, things that often make you feel dirty, disgusting, and ashamed, that somehow one "allowed" the rape to happen at all. I believe that society's attitudes toward sex play an important factor in all of this. To "blame" the victim often feels like you are being raped all over again.

Rape is not sex, it's violence and control. If one doesn't take back one's power, one ends up a perpetual and eternal victim.

Always, and I'll go further.

The famous 'come shot' of a male splattering his semen over a female face is part of this rape or violence. IMO, the 'come shot' was only a devise to overcome the obvious fake f@@@ing. IMO, it has nothing to do with sex. I'd thought that I was odd in this until yesterday thanks to ClipMarks. Dakotayii posted "Sex in Japan" and reading it fully indicated that any semen spillage anywhere is a total no no in Japanese society.

This and similar preaches the message that females are no more that tools of male pleasure. That me...

Rape is not sex, it's violence and control. If one doesn't take back one's power, one ends up a perpetual and eternal victim.

Always, and I'll go further.

The famous 'come shot' of a male splattering his semen over a female face is part of this rape or violence. IMO, the 'come shot' was only a devise to overcome the obvious fake f@@@ing. IMO, it has nothing to do with sex. I'd thought that I was odd in this until yesterday thanks to ClipMarks. Dakotayii posted "Sex in Japan" and reading it fully indicated that any semen spillage anywhere is a total no no in Japanese society.

This and similar preaches the message that females are no more that tools of male pleasure. That message leads to rapes. "Sure, she was gagging for it." "She's giving it freely to him, I want some too." Can any female what sexual pleasure there is for a female spending 10/20 minutes with a penis stuffed down her throat for him to then spray her face. Every amateur pair with a video camera is copying this model and so perpetuating this new myth of human sexuality. "If you love me, you'll do the same!"

What's with this slapping on the buttocks? Why this connection of violence with sex. If you accept/enjoy/encourage such slapping about, are you not bring rape and violence on your sisters? Is competition between females for male attention the start of the problem? Slut for me isn't the number of partners. It is what you'll tolerate to retain a pig male!

what they actually did "wrong" is very important too

What they did wrong?? I totally disagree. If you believe a rape victim is in ANY way responsible for the actions of another, then you are simply perpetuating the myth, that the victim "asked for it" in some way. I won't accept that.

If you walk alone down a street and a dog comes along and bites you, would you feel guilty? If you visited the home of someone and their dog bit you, would you feel guilty? If you had just eaten a steak so you smelled of meat, are you guilty of provoking the attack? If you wore clothes that did not protect you from the bite, are you guilty? If you knew the dog and trusted it, but it bit you any...

what they actually did "wrong" is very important too

What they did wrong?? I totally disagree. If you believe a rape victim is in ANY way responsible for the actions of another, then you are simply perpetuating the myth, that the victim "asked for it" in some way. I won't accept that.

If you walk alone down a street and a dog comes along and bites you, would you feel guilty? If you visited the home of someone and their dog bit you, would you feel guilty? If you had just eaten a steak so you smelled of meat, are you guilty of provoking the attack? If you wore clothes that did not protect you from the bite, are you guilty? If you knew the dog and trusted it, but it bit you anyway, are you then guilty of the attack?

Rapists are animals. What they do does not reflect in ANY way on the victim. No. The victim is NOT responsible in the least for the actions of the attacker.

If they ran down the road stark raving naked and drunk as a skunk, that STILL does not exonerate anyone from taking advantage of that. The guilt for rape lies wholly and solely on one person. The perpetrator.

I think that the predator has already come to a conclusion that he was going to commit the action prior to picking out the victim. I do not think the victim was at blame maybe at the wrong place at the wrong time.

Good thinking. Next I would think that any male who is having regular sex with a consenting partner would have no interest in jeopardising this good sex by becoming a predictor rapist, unless he's totally sick and very dangerous.

So it's those not getting it and believing that it's available all around but not for him. He probably also feels that she'll be gagging for it once he displays his erection. How he can get it up at all in such cases is beyond me or my ca...

I think that the predator has already come to a conclusion that he was going to commit the action prior to picking out the victim. I do not think the victim was at blame maybe at the wrong place at the wrong time.

Good thinking. Next I would think that any male who is having regular sex with a consenting partner would have no interest in jeopardising this good sex by becoming a predictor rapist, unless he's totally sick and very dangerous.

So it's those not getting it and believing that it's available all around but not for him. He probably also feels that she'll be gagging for it once he displays his erection. How he can get it up at all in such cases is beyond me or my capabilities, which of course explains the underlying violent aspect of this supposed sex.

I believe that the kernel of the problem of rapists is this cross over between sex and violence. In another recent clip I mentioned slapping on buttocks but got no response. I believe that this 'play' that females may or may not encourage may be the starting point for the rapist in the cross over from sex to violence.

Am I making any sense here?

Righty, You bring up a good point, and that is does consenting sex play dim the line between violence and sex? I don't see it as that way because what two consenting adults do within the privacy of their own homes is their own personal business, as long as they aren't hurting anyone.

Yes and NO! If the consensual sex remained only within that bedroom. Those whose 'play' is a little more inclined to take it outside their bedroom and have it on the internet! There it gets aped by other 'consenting' adults. So before you know it the net is flooded with more young amateurs that are buttock smacking, semen splashing, anal fuc@ing, etc. The logic being [i]"if you love me you'll do...

Righty, You bring up a good point, and that is does consenting sex play dim the line between violence and sex? I don't see it as that way because what two consenting adults do within the privacy of their own homes is their own personal business, as long as they aren't hurting anyone.

Yes and NO! If the consensual sex remained only within that bedroom. Those whose 'play' is a little more inclined to take it outside their bedroom and have it on the internet! There it gets aped by other 'consenting' adults. So before you know it the net is flooded with more young amateurs that are buttock smacking, semen splashing, anal fuc@ing, etc. The logic being "if you love me you'll do what she's doing for him" copycat 'sex'. The female is pressured as is the male to a lesser extent. Before you know it the whole US engaged in the latest 'sex'.

There is no one more in favour of genuine consensual sex. My doubt is inability of the female to ensure always that the act is to her interest also. Recently here I've asked the question about force within a relationship while discussing rape. No response. Why? Too close to the bone? "No means no" didn't answer my question. Glib but pointless. How mutual is power in the bedroom? A recent BBC Panorama TV program on teen sex that I've clipped has shocked me, so I'm a bit on 'tilt' on this subject just now.

I used believe that as more progressive societies provided outlets for the males with no normal outlet for their sexual drive that the problem of rapes would lessen dramatically. I don't now for a number of reasons.

First is the mechanical sex that you see on the net. You know 10 minutes in one position, 15 doggie, 20 anal, some buttock beating and the money shot with facial coverage. Now even the amateurs are following the script. Mechanical. Boring. Yet females feel obliged to conform. The male thinks standard fare is out. It resembles sexual love making as much as two dogs on the street.

Second was that BBC program. The newspapers details a lot but not all. Why these young girls start...

I used believe that as more progressive societies provided outlets for the males with no normal outlet for their sexual drive that the problem of rapes would lessen dramatically. I don't now for a number of reasons.

First is the mechanical sex that you see on the net. You know 10 minutes in one position, 15 doggie, 20 anal, some buttock beating and the money shot with facial coverage. Now even the amateurs are following the script. Mechanical. Boring. Yet females feel obliged to conform. The male thinks standard fare is out. It resembles sexual love making as much as two dogs on the street.

Second was that BBC program. The newspapers details a lot but not all. Why these young girls started and continued with sex is not explained by drugs or alcohol alone. They appeared to me to be high on SEX. Their excuses for continuing didn't stack up. Some things that they said threw into doubt the whole line about consenting sex. Explain non-consenting while being held by two more, as others watched, and then returning for more later! Or why out of the very large number, very few kids themselves are coming forward! The BBC showed mug shots of the perpetrators and they were as ugly as they come.

righthand
no normal outlet for their sexual drive that the problem of rapes would lessen

Again, it's NOT about sex. It's about domination. Control. A rapist is just as often married, has kids or a girlfriend. He often gets his sexual needs fulfilled, BUT perhaps he had a very domineering mother, or he can't "control" his wife or is bullied at work, so he feels a need to have control of something, or someone else. It's a quest for power, NOT sexual release. It's not about sex.

Are you at all interested in debating the issue or in attempting to dominate the debate with your lopsided personal experience which has totally screwed your ability to have any meaningfu...

righthand
no normal outlet for their sexual drive that the problem of rapes would lessen

Again, it's NOT about sex. It's about domination. Control. A rapist is just as often married, has kids or a girlfriend. He often gets his sexual needs fulfilled, BUT perhaps he had a very domineering mother, or he can't "control" his wife or is bullied at work, so he feels a need to have control of something, or someone else. It's a quest for power, NOT sexual release. It's not about sex.

Are you at all interested in debating the issue or in attempting to dominate the debate with your lopsided personal experience which has totally screwed your ability to have any meaningful input with those of us willing to learn. Your input is the equal of having a raped female as a member of a jury on a rape case! Must one have been raped to have an opinion on the rape? Your way or no way. Get a life, lady!

Why does a woman stay with a man who beats her? Or commits marital rape? Why doesn't a child "tell someone" when they are being sexually abused? Control. They are controlled. It's a terrible form of manipulation. They don't stay because they get "high on sex". They stay because they think, they can't leave.

When our rape 'expert' is WRONG then everything she contends about her expertise is thrown into dispute. I saw the BBC program. Did you? After all of these experiences the girls went home, but were back for more! When the parents attempted to lock them in they broke out. When one was asked why she had sex with five tricks she said it was easier that the alternative and fr...

Why does a woman stay with a man who beats her? Or commits marital rape? Why doesn't a child "tell someone" when they are being sexually abused? Control. They are controlled. It's a terrible form of manipulation. They don't stay because they get "high on sex". They stay because they think, they can't leave.

When our rape 'expert' is WRONG then everything she contends about her expertise is thrown into dispute. I saw the BBC program. Did you? After all of these experiences the girls went home, but were back for more! When the parents attempted to lock them in they broke out. When one was asked why she had sex with five tricks she said it was easier that the alternative and from the past, she'd always given in eventually.

When they were being groomed initially, they knew what was happening. There was even some joke remark about a fuc@ for a fag. This before they turned tricks. When intercepted by police in Asian areas, they were totally uncooperative, giving false ages and names. There was no outward sign of drink or drugs or the cops could have taken then in.

I'd wish our expert was correct. Then this would be simple. Bad men. Well this program opened my eyes. There are bad girls too. The evidence that I've seen says that domination is not the only thing at play here.

I've had fucking enough here-
Right hand you piss ant-
who do you think you are? an expert on every god damn thing?
Is there a reason you call yourself "right hand?" is it the one you use the most? and for what, oh i'm sorry it is quite obvious-
Go outside once in a while and maybe talk to a real human being, maybe even a girl- your lack of respect for everybody no matter what they have to say rivals willhelms you selfish fucknut, and I came back to clipmarks after half a year just to tell you to shut the fuck up- now you take your shellaliegh and stick it where it belongs, and i expect you to apologize to all the rape victims on this page and never count your opinion higher than those who h...

I've had fucking enough here-
Right hand you piss ant-
who do you think you are? an expert on every god damn thing?
Is there a reason you call yourself "right hand?" is it the one you use the most? and for what, oh i'm sorry it is quite obvious-
Go outside once in a while and maybe talk to a real human being, maybe even a girl- your lack of respect for everybody no matter what they have to say rivals willhelms you selfish fucknut, and I came back to clipmarks after half a year just to tell you to shut the fuck up- now you take your shellaliegh and stick it where it belongs, and i expect you to apologize to all the rape victims on this page and never count your opinion higher than those who have actually lived it-
and you call yourself Irish-
you suck buddy-
Oh yeah hi Deb- High TN you guys OK?

from Dirish
The first time I told him my dick was bigger than his, and this time I showed him -
Oh yeah, be warned that I use bad language in this one, so don't read the joke if you are easily offended by the word horse!

Well the language hasn't improved. Still think you're a big dick? Most chauvinists do. You know those John Wayne types who know they must protect the gals. Those chauvinists that don't believe in the equality of the sexes. The real big dicks. Dickheads more like that degrade females with their foul mouths on an open forum. Put a condom on and give your unfortunate wife a chance to come up for breath after your exercise your congenial rights yet again....

from Dirish
The first time I told him my dick was bigger than his, and this time I showed him -
Oh yeah, be warned that I use bad language in this one, so don't read the joke if you are easily offended by the word horse!

Well the language hasn't improved. Still think you're a big dick? Most chauvinists do. You know those John Wayne types who know they must protect the gals. Those chauvinists that don't believe in the equality of the sexes. The real big dicks. Dickheads more like that degrade females with their foul mouths on an open forum. Put a condom on and give your unfortunate wife a chance to come up for breath after your exercise your congenial rights yet again. Better still put it on your head and give mankind a boost. The pagan catholic is it still? You made a whole lot of sense with that.

I am a practicing catholic that attends to and practices pagan philosophy. This may appear to be two diametrically opposed viewpoints

I would not go that far. Foul mouthed chauvinist is accurate. Bush supporter, still? Swiftboater? Neo-Con? Close?